DODGERS The CUBANS Thread

I'm disappointed that we didn't go after Moncada right now, I understand they want to get as much value as possible, but to me Moncada was worth it alone. I hope he busts.

 

Really? That is just stupid, it isn't like he signed with the Giants.

 

Who needs players when they have Epstein looking into Gagne's "medicals", learning he only succeeded because of PEDs and then pulling the trigger on the trade.

 

They have $166 million committed to a 10 man roster. The only way they reset the tax and get under $189 million is to fill the other 30 spots at league minimum.

 

and or jettison some of that 10 man 166 million committment. I didn't post the link but someone else did about some GM's speculating they would trade Ryu or Zach near the deadline. Seemed crazy to some. Seems obvious they would love for Zach to opt out. What is the penalty 40% next year? Front loading the money they have to send to San Diego for Kemp was smart as it is only a little over 3 million after this year. There is another possible path if desired path that might work and be sorta brilliant and is sorta in the works. They are building up the farm system and creating good depth and could possibly package a CC and a Dre with prospects to get other teams to take on all if not the brunt of their salaries etc. Instead of using prospects to get talent we use them to unload overpriced talent.

 

I can almost understand trading Grienke, but Ryu? Never. He's a bargain at $7.8 mil/per for the next three years. Back of the rotation starters are getting that much and more (see: Haren, Dan). And make no mistake, Dre nor CC aren't going anywhere unless there is a cashiers check tied around each of their necks, I don't care how many prospects you send with them. If the FO nerds aren't willing to part with prospects to get talent, then why would they part with them to unload salary? Ok, low level prospects sure, but who wants low level prospects in return for eating chunks of salary that don't provide value in return? No, the only way Dre and CC go is the same way Dee and Dan went, with their salary in their pockets.

 

Per the topic of this thread you could sign a lot of Cubans for the money they will be paid after July 2. Remember it isn't just their salary but the luxury tax on all salary over 185 million. So figure out your core roster and once that hits 189 million each additional dollar includes luxury tax money. Sorta like taxes especially as you get older and have to start drawing down investments and realize that their are tax thresholds and when you go over them your marginal tax rate increases so you try to plan and manage. Tis also true with a baseball roster when you start to hit the stratosphere level which we have. The luxury tax is progressive and goes up. luxury tax paid is horrible opportunity cost if it is for dead weight and the trade off is giving up international talent.

http://www.stevetheump.com/luxury_tax.htm
Last year we paid 26. 6 million for 2014

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luxury_tax_(sports)#Major_League_Baseball_.28MLB.29
The threshold level for the luxury tax will be $189MM in 2014 (up from $178MM from 2011-2013) and will remain at $189MM through 2016. From 2012 through 2016, teams who exceed the threshold for the first time must pay 17.5% of the amount they are over, 30% for the second consecutive year over, 40% for the third consecutive year over, and 50% for four or more consecutive years over the cap.[4]

This is year three of us being over the cap and that amount will jump needless to say. Next year would be year four and a rate of 50% wasted. So if Dre and Crawford are a combined 60 million and bench players add 30 million to what they cost us if we are still well over the luxury benchmark by their salary. Expensive role players when over the luxury tax can be damn expensive especially in year 4.

 

Like I said, at the price we're paying Ryu, it would be foolish to trade him. If you're about value, he is it. It's Dre, CC, and to some extent A-Gon who aren't returning fair value.

 

Very true Ryu by himself but as part of a package? In the link someone else posted it was all of the recent signings of injured players who had been top talent pitchers previously. As they become healthy they give roster flexibility. If all of these guys recovering from TJ surgery return to top form do we trade them or use them? If we use them we need a spot for them.

 

Why move him at all? He provides GREAT value. Package some one with less value, Grienke and Dre would be an excellent start, that is if you're into moving Grienke. That way you move MORE salary, and more salary that is NOT providing value.

I'll go so far as to say that if management moved Ryu at this point I'd be very pissed, it would be Delino for Pedro all over again.

 

http://www.truebluela.com/2012/12/10/3748440/hyun-jin-ryu-contract-details
Like Zack Greinke, Ryu has an opt-our clause in his contract. If Ryu pitches 750 innings in the first five years of the contract, he can opt out after 2017 and become a free agent heading into his age-31 season

Closer he gets to 2017 his trade value might diminish. If and I only say if because his name has been thrown out, he has two years of team control after this year at what you have rightfully called a discount for his ability.

 

Problem is Zach has his opt out after this year and would be a short term rental if traded and have diminished value. All you say about him is true but his contract status for next year and his unwillingness to discuss it til the season over negates much trade value. Also worse case scenario is he gets hurt or appears hurt and no one would want him at a higher salary if he opts out. Zach opt out after 2015 and Ryu 2017. Also if they moved players in July that is after the June 2 international signing period opening and that is money to spend on Cubans per the thread title. How do we free up cash to sign players after July 2 when we are paying for a massive payroll plus tax now?

 

I'm not in favor of trading Zach anyway, I was just trying to point out that trading Ryu would be ridiculous. Who said we had to free up cash to sign anyone? It's not about freeing up cash, it's about being able to spend without jeopardizing future signings. You seem to be uber worried over the financing. I don't care where the money comes from (don't say it comes from me, because living in NC I spend next to nothing on the Dodgers or MLB.) Thanks for reminding me about Ryu's opt out, I had forgotten it.

 

You are in Greensboro right

 

No, I'm south of there, a good 60 miles.

 

Close to Charlotte or Salisbury someone else is from Greensboro on hetr

 

I rather not regret not signing him? I know every situation is different and if he was elsewhere it might end up completely different, but you can't say you would be happy if he's a MVP caliber player.

 

Still certainly not going to root for him to fail just because management wouldn't pony up. It isn't like he is a total asshole (that we know of).

 

Lucky Greensboro

 

Something pretty shitty is going to have to go down for the dodgers to be shopping Greinke and/or Ryu at the deadline. They are also trying to contend this year and I don't project the dodgers to be sellers at the deadline.

As for the CC and Dre scenarios. I don't think this will end up saving $ for the dodgers. This move would be more wise in trying to upgrade talent trading over paid and prospects for someone who can actually play well. This return likely isn't going to have a small contract themselves.