Last nail on Ned's coffin

Discussion in 'Los Angeles DODGERS' started by 4everblue, Dec 6, 2011.

  1. 4everblue

    4everblue DSP Regular

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    This is surely the last nail on Ned's coffin... his signings this winter have been THE WORST since he arrived... yes, he's had some weird signings, but these ones top it... here's a table posted on truebluela

    Pos Player Age 2012 Salary
    SP Harang 34 $4,500,000
    OF/1B Rivera 33 $4,000,000
    SP Capuano 33 $3,000,000
    2B Ellis 35 $2,500,000
    IF/OF Hairston 36 $2,250,000
    Totals $16,250,000

    and for 2013

    Pos Player Age 2013 Salary
    SP Harang 35 $7,500,000
    SP Capuano 34 $6,000,000
    2B Ellis 36 $5,250,000
    OF/1B Rivera 34 $4,000,000
    IF/OF Hairston 37 $3,750,000
    Totals $26,500,000

    the impact those contract have are HUGE, and here are just some of the points

    1. now you have officially blocked all your pitching prospects (De La Rosa, Eovaldi, Lee, all of them) because your rotation is supposed to be set for 2013. that is unless someone goes down (which is expected, specially between Lilly, Capuranus and Herman Monster). If that happens, you just have dumped a lot of money on an injured player that cant produce (see Juan Uribe)

    2. you have officially blocked all your IF prospects, as Uribe still has another 2 years, so we wont see Sellers, De Jesus, Mitchell, Russell, any of those guys playing unless (once again) you have an expensive over the hill overpaid veteran injured.

    but the biggest issue here its not 2012, its more about 2013 AND 2014...

    most of these contracts are simply impossible to trade, as NO ONE other than Ned will pay Capuano $6M, or $7M to Harang, even less trade one of the old mistakes as Lilly's $12M. The only one that MIGHT have a chance is Uribe, but he's long away from it.

    also, it leaves the 2014 roster with big holes. That offseason we'll need to get

    3 starters
    regular 3B
    regular 2B
    utility IF
    reliever (to replace Gurrier)

    and that is assuming that in 2013 we solved the 1B, LF, RF issues as Loney, Ethier and Rivera are FAs...

    by that time, we probably have traded all our decent prospect or they'll be rotting in AAA because there's no place for them with the big club...

    this guy is simply creating a huge headache to whoever buys the team, and I really hope he gets his ass fired as soon as the team is sold...
     
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  2. LAFord

    LAFord DSP Legend

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    Eh, salaries go up...everyone in the baseball is making more than last season....that's how it works sometimes. It's like the year we signed Pierre and the Angels signed Matthews Jr. They were grossly overpaid, but everyone was that season. This is just one of those seasons.
     
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  3. 4everblue

    4everblue DSP Regular

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    Herman Monster had a $5M option with the Padres, which they DECLINED, even after he was maybe his 2nd best pitcher... and we sign him for more than that... Hairston salary is absurd, more if you think that Miles could provide the same production... Instead of Hairston, Kennedy and Ellis, I would have stayed with De Jesus/Sellers ($500K), Carroll (2y $7M) and Miles (1y for at least $1.5).
     
  4. irish

    irish DSP Staff Member Administrator

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    All that money (plus the unnecessary $850K for Treanor) could and should have gone toward Fielder. You're offering more in deferred money to all these scrubs, why not offer it to Prince? No new owner is going to be happy walking into these, but what would irritate them less... having to pay it for a bunch of also rans, or for a marquee player?
     
  5. blueplatespecial

    blueplatespecial DSP Legend

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    Yes, IDJ/Sellars, Carroll and Miles would have given you the same production for cheap - and more importantly, they would have bought you some time - time to put together a plan for a five year infield - which should always be the goal. There must be time to build up the farm with some near future MLB starter IF type guys. And we must have power at the corners. And if you find your puzzle pieces sooner, rather than later, then these old guys go back to being utility guys - which is what they really are on a halfway decent team anyway.
     
  6. Doughty8

    Doughty8 DSP Legend

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    Can we stop with the we could have signed Fielder with that money! We cannot commit to a 10 year contract to anybody at this point for crying out loud! If Fielder signed for 2 years yes that would be a good comparison but he isn't unfortunately. The team is not sold and it won't be before March at the earliest, can we not forget that minor detail as well? All the detractors of Prince say he is fat and bound to get hurt and you want to sign him for 10 years?????? Albert will be 32 and you want 1 guy with a 20+ million dollar salary at 42? You think Texas enjoyed having that albatross of a contract by A-Rod? A-Rod was in his prime at that time, I just don't get it. I know the lure of Albert and Fielder is tempting but that still doesn't guarantee squat next season.

    10 year contracts talk about blocking prospects and mucking up your flexibility. I am done with this free agent stuff because the season hasn't started and NOBODY knows the future and it's getting rather annoying to read all the repetitive criticisms and the beating of the proverbial dead horse regarding Ned. I am going to focus on the pending ownership change which is more interesting anyway.
     
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  7. irish

    irish DSP Staff Member Administrator

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    I see, so its okay for you to opine but not for anyone else?
    If you don't agree with something someone says, fine. That's your right to say so. But to tell people to stop with their thoughts and opinions -- especially on a forum -- is a bit much. If you don't want to hear people speculate about a Prince Fielder or weigh-in on the ineptness of Ned, you're probably in the wrong place.
     
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  8. irish

    irish DSP Staff Member Administrator

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    speaking of Ned, I bet this has piqued his interest...

    Giants Trying To Trade Keppinger, Torres, Ramirez
    By Tim Dierkes [December 6 at 12:37pm CST]

    12:37pm: It'd be a fairly easy call for the Giants to non-tender Keppinger, reports Andrew Baggarly of the San Jose Mercury News. Baggarly also notes that the Giants intend to work out a multiyear deal with starter Ryan Vogelsong, who would be eligible for free agency after 2012. For more on the Giants' huge arbitration class, read up here.

    11:34am: The Giants are trying to trade infielder Jeff Keppinger, outfielder Andres Torres, and reliever Ramon Ramirez, tweets Danny Knobler of CBS Sports. They're planning to keep lefty Jeremy Affeldt. ESPN's Buster Olney says there's a strong feeling by other teams Torres will be non-tendered. If so, the Giants may not be able to get much for him. Torres was the second-most valuable center fielder in baseball in 2010, based on FanGraphs' wins above replacement.

    Keppinger, Torres, and Ramirez are all arbitration eligible, and MLBTR projects salaries in the $2.3-2.7MM range for each.
     
  9. Doughty8

    Doughty8 DSP Legend

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    I never stop guys from opining but have you looked at all the threads? I was just hoping to somehow limit it to 4 threads that is all. Have you seen the countless references to Ned and how bad he is and that doesn't annoy you at least a little? I just expressing my frustrations without stepping on other posters toes and apparently it didn't work. If you don't think this topic is over excessive and redundant then you have more patience that I do.

    I welcome all opinions and I think I am pretty open minded but wow Fielder references in every signing thread got to me.
     
  10. LAFord

    LAFord DSP Legend

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    Both Fielder and Albert were due for raises this season and their respective teams aren't willing to pay. They must not be worth it either.

    Saying Miles is as good as Hairston is just crazy man. Miles plays 1 position decent. He's an abomination at 3B. He has 0 power. Hairston is a far more usefull utility guy.
     
  11. MZA

    MZA MODERATOR Staff Member

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    how is the topic over excessive if Ned has been making these deals pretty close to one another? We are just reacting to the signings which haven't been that great (some are outright horrible)
     
  12. doyerfan

    doyerfan MODERATOR Staff Member Moderator

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    I will never get annoyed at hating on Ned, he has hurt the Dodgers worse than Frank. He is a fucking retarded piece of shit who belongs no where near a front office making the decisions he makes for the Dodgers. You have got to be kidding me if you think we had an even average offseason. The money committed to shitty players in 2013 is fucking huge, and it's not even about signing Fielder or Pujols. He could have had a fucking brain and signed Pena, Kuroda, Ellis, and utility players for the same amount of cash he spent on all the shit he spent it on

    When a guy like Jerry hairston Jr. is going to get his biggest salary of his career at age 36 after an average season, you know something is wrong with the GM
     
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  13. Doughty8

    Doughty8 DSP Legend

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    Can't judge horrible in the off-season and without seeing the guys play or pitch or even playing one game. I guess I was hoping to see the off-season thread used properly but I know that is probably impossible. You are right the deals are close together and it's probably just me but I see Ned's name 500 times a day and it became too much when I wrote that post..
     
  14. MZA

    MZA MODERATOR Staff Member

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    If you know that Ned's name is going to come up, you shouldn't post if you're gonna hate it. We have other threads here, too. Like I said, these guys can be fine, it's just the money they are being given. We're tired of Ned's mismanagement of money. Keeping him as a GM will be a major mistake by the new owner once he comes in.
     
  15. Doughty8

    Doughty8 DSP Legend

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    Hairston I agree 100% but give the agent credit too. Ned is the GM of the Dodgers so I don't agree he is retarded. All I am saying is you can't judge signings until those players ACTUALLY play for the team. Teams on paper don't win games, they win fantasy leagues but not real games and that is yet to be determined. Trades and acquisitions are never properly assessed until time passes. Give the team a chance to prove you right or wrong and time is the only determinant factor.
     
  16. bestlakersfan

    bestlakersfan DSP Legend

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    HiKu, Sellers, Miles and Carroll>> Cap, Harang, Ellis and Harriston for likely a few $M less.
     
  17. Doughty8

    Doughty8 DSP Legend

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    That's just it his name is everywhere even when the topic has nothing to do with him. When it is WELL established that Ned is hated on here and yet there is a need post it anyway and I am not guiltless in that practice, it becomes redundant. As far as the money goes, if you and I were in the room and we knew about the contract negotiations then we can say Ned blew it but we are not. The last I heard there are 2 parties in a negotiation and they should get credit too. I have never been concerned with the money portion because of that fact, I am more concerned with the years and the players age.
     
  18. rube

    rube DSP Legend Staff Member Administrator

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    ned threads arent redudant while ned is still running our team
     
  19. TuborgP

    TuborgP DSP Legend

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    We need to remember we had the most free agents of any team I believe it was ten. That created a lot of holes to be filled by a number of players. One big signing was only going to cover one position and when you already had that spot covered it made it easier to not go there. Had we had a true vacancy at first we might have given a first baseman a longer look.
     
  20. 4everblue

    4everblue DSP Regular

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    maybe Hairston is better than Miles, but I double that he's $6M better... and for all those talking about Fielder and Albert, this threat is NOT ABOUT THEM... I knew since day 1 that they were out of our reach...

    NOW, when you dump $16M on 5 players while having better options, that is called stupidity... and I say it again, someone needs to kick Logan White's ass in the process, as he's the head of scouting, so he has a say on players signing...

    here's what I would have done

    SP Kuroda $14M (prorate $3M)
    OF/1B Sands $500K
    SP Eovaldi $500K
    2B Carroll $3M
    IF/OF Miles $1M

    that's about the same spending but with a solid pitcher...
     

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