Ethier's arm isn't nearly as good as Crawford's range in the outfield ( where his speed is used ) so what you're saying is 15 steals in a banged up season, getting waved around 3B in an aggressive move to try to get a run on the board, range factor in the outfield...these things display no speed? you know i thought when Wallach waved CC around 3B in a HUGE Game 3 that people would start to see how speed can be used OUTSIDE OF HAVING 40 STOLEN BASES nope...no speed there i suppose. i'm sure in the minds of Ethier fans they think Ethier could've done that " if he were healthy ". Ethier's not slow, but he's nowhere near as fast as Crawford
I mean, wtv, is what it is. I sound insane defending Ethier this much, but I just can't see how you'd rather go forward with Carl on this team rather than him. Ethier has more trade value than Carl thats for sure, but if we are going to trade Ethier, I really don't want Carl starting in LF. I think that it sucks to have him there when I truly believe we can upgrade either via trade, minors, or free agency A perfect situation is get literally anything for Carl, start Kemp/Puig/Ethier, SVS as Ethiers platoon, and Joc comes up at first injury
This is one of the worst articles I've read in quite some time. What's concerning is that he had a good OBP in 2009 and also had a good one in 2013? How the fuck is that concerning? I'm concerned about Miguel Cabrera, he hit .330 last year and then hit .330 again this year. Not a good sign IMO. Also, "to add to that mediocrity"? The average CF had a .714 OPS in 2013. The average RF had a .743 OPS. Ethier had a .783 OPS in his worst season. Does this guy not understand what the word mediocre means?
Haha, I barely realized this is all cause of a bleacher report article. Smh, the posters on this board could write better articles than them in a half drunk state
get over that too. i said Ethier doesn't have anything that they need talent-wise because they hit righties just fine as a team . if you're talking keep him for " depth "...OK. where i disagree is him starting ahead of Crawford. you need to read this stuff before you post it instead of just going to extremes that's seriously wrong, but seriously what Ethier fans tell themselves also. people give legit reasons for wanting Ethier gone...you don't wanna see them though. like the fact that you think Crawford doesn't use his speed...AS THE TEAM'S BEST DEFENSIVE OUTFIELDER. all he has is range in the outfield...what?...is he using a motorcycle to run down balls? if you don't wanna be fair, be honest.
you're late to this party. i would've thought you would've been here to protect " our 3rd best hitter " lol like i said before, and you can read up the page...Dodgers hit right handed pitching fine as a team. they will not miss Ethier in that category. if anything we need another right-handed bat. getting Guerrero was a start. Kemp coming back will be great for our hitting against lefties as well. if Ethier was as good a fielder as Crawford or brought speed dynamics to the roster, you guys would have a point
wellllllll, wtv its pointless lol. I guess we're fine against righties so we don't need him, just like we're fine with our pitching so maybe we don't need greinke Carl is an inferior hitter to Ethier who has the same problem as Ethier (hitting vs. lefties) but is even worse, without being better at the opposite spectrum. He runs better, he's got that and he plays better D but can only play 1 position compared to Ethier being average at one and maybe a bit above average in the other two. If you'd rather have the guy stuck in one position who is declining in hitting and doesn't really do anything special with the bat but is a good defensive player who runs well and hitter over the more versatile, superior hitter who can play a premiere position than... Ok.
CC as a leadoff hitter adds a bit more team value to him in my mind. He okay in that role, not great, but enough to get through another season. I would rather not send Ned out looking for lead off hitters, because he'll just come back with a bunch of scrubs and it'll suck.
The only reason people see Carl as a leadoff guy is cause he has some speed. He had a .329 OBP last year, I would much rather our leadoff guy have a better OBP than that regardless of speed. I mean, .329 just is so meh. Mark Ellis had a .323 OBP He also only saw 3.62 pitches per plate appearance. Thats the same amount as notorious free swinger Juan Uribe His speed would be great out of the leadoff spot if he got on base more often but he doesnt, so his use as a leadoff man is kinda diminished
1) The .023 OPS difference in hitting RHP vs LHP literally disappears when you remove Ethier from the equation. Essentially, the reason we hit RHP at a higher clip than LHP this season is because of Ethier. You act like it's a significant cap, it's not, with Kemp back in 2014 I'd put us a little better vs LHP actually, considering Kemp and a full season of Puig. 2) Ethier is a better baseball player than Carl Crawford. You can say "We need a fast guy not a guy who can hit RHP" all you want, but Ethier is an all around more valuable player. Team needs is an overrated concept. Who, may I ask, is fast on the Cardinals? Matt Carpenter and Carlos Beltran hit leadoff for them, Carpenter stole 3 bases and Beltran hasn't been fast since 'Nam. I'm not completely against the idea that if a team comes to us and says they want Ethier, and if Crawford isn't sought after, trading Ethier and going with CC, Kemp and Puig, but Ethier is better than Crawford, and if Crawford is retained over Ethier it's most likely because more teams wanted Ethier.
And that's not even getting into the fact that the main attribute you give Crawford over Ethier is the most declining part of an aging players game, and hitting/OBP skills age the most gracefully, which is Ethier's main skill.
I'm thinking realistically: I don't know who else you get on this roster to lead off. I think it's a problem. Maybe not a huge point in the AE vs CC dialogue, but it's something to mention. Ultimately, I want them both gone - but just not all at once. For me, it's all about who is most likely to tank next year, but I concede it may be both.
I don't get your obsession with speed...I bet you thought Juan Pierre should start instead of Manny in 09'.
Gotcha, but I don't think a team HAS to have a guy with good speed to hit leadoff. It helps, but if a player can't get on base that well than he doesn't belong in the leadoff spot. But I really like Yasiel hitting leadoff. Against righties, I love a set up of Yasiel- Andre-Hanley-Adrian-Kemp Yasiel is so dynamic leading off and Ethiers OBP is great right there in the 2 hole. That set up is insanely better than Crawford-Ellis 1 and 2
Agreed - pure speed is not essential at leadoff. However, Puig hitting 1st or 2nd is amazing because of his speed. I loved watching him turn it on out of the box and beat even the most routine ground out's - wow. But I like Puig in the two slot better. I know, you typically want a mature type hitter batting second, to move runners over - but, Puig is someone who almost always beats out DP's. (I was close to vomiting throughout the post season, watching Ellis). And he was also great at slapping out a single when it was needed. Totally clutch. And, of course, his insane power. I just like the chance of someone on base when Puig comes up. Crawford-1, Puig-2 was working out well for us during that insane winning streak. Oh, I'm not so sure about Ethier hitting second. He has had very few abs hitting second - like 5 abs in 2013. And not many career abs batting 2nd in the lineup. Whereas, he's a proven fifth slot hitter, his best numbers are there, anyway. I don't think the aging Ethier gets out of the box in a hurry these days. In other words, he could be another dp machine waiting to happen. Besides, his strength is that nice lefty power stroke with a clean base hit attached. So, I say, if you keep him, you must continue to put him down in the order and just let him swing away - with out any hit-an-run signs attached. But, my big concern with Ethier is his health. I don't think he stays off the DL next season. That's just an opinion, though, and one gotten by casting bones and consulting tarot cards. But the forecast is clear - it says: you should move him, quick, while he is walking upright.
